Mitchell 308 pinion assembly... "something ain't right!"

[TheCoachZed]

Picked up a Mitchell 308 today. Disassembled the main body and cleaned it, but it is still binding and grinding. Can't get the rotor off; I believe it should pop right off once the nut and set screw are removed, but that doesn't work.

Suggestions?

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[Sandman]

Zed, to the MRM.

I’ve had that happen a number of times. The pinion is stuck in the body housing. I’ve had to tap the pinion gear with a dowel from the inside of the body. Have to use just the right size dowel and it will be at a bit of an angle, but it has always worked. Never hurts to let sit overnight with some penetrating oil. Taking the axle nut off doesn’t help, as it only frees the rotor housing from the pinion shaft. I would suggest screwing off the rotor before pounding out the pinion. You won’t be able to get the pinion off the rotor without putting back in the body otherwise. It sounds like you may need to take the pinion off the rotor, if the pinion bearing assembly or gearing is bad. Removing the pinion from the rotor can be tricky too, there is a good procedure in a topic for that here.

Sandman

[TheCoachZed]

Thanks, Sandman. I found some of your earlier posts so I might be able to piece together a solution.

I seem to have two problems.

1, the bearings around the pinion gear seem to be grinding.

2, the arm that sticks through the "rotating head" and actuated the bale seems to be binding when I reel it in. That part of the reel rotation, when part 68 is actuated (Trip Lever?, is binding up and making reeling most unpleasant.



3, I guess the third problem is that the head does not want to come reel's main body, and that has to come off to access the other assemblies.

I have it soaking in Seafoam Deep Creep right now. If that doesn't work, will try some ATF/acetone mix.

[Sandman]

Hi Zed…

#1) The bearings could be grinding….I’ve found the most common grinding noise on the 308 is the pinion gear meshing with the main gear. This gear design is not the quietest ever and if someone changed one of the gears along the way, that increases the likely hood of poor meshing. You won’t know until you remove the pinion from the housing and turn it to test for noise or wobble. You can then place the pinion (while still attached to the head) back in the body to remove it from the housing to replace it or rebuild it. I rebuild mine and use Quantum HotSauce for grease. Be careful. There are 34 VERY small ball bearings. Two rows of 17. The other trick to these is placing the pinion back on the body after you’ve rebuilt it. Getting it just the right torque is imperative to smooth operation.

#2) If the trip lever continues to drag when the bail is released, it means your trip lever is out of shape. Commonly, it’s the end where it touches the bail. It doesn’t take much for them to bend and then they’re not in the correct spot/position when the bail is released. Needle nose pliers and a little experimenting and you’ll find the right spot. They usually get bent downward toward the body.

#3) Glad you found my step-by-step for removing the pinion from the head. I learned the hard way.

Stick with it. We’ll get you there.

Sandman

[my308]

Hi Sandman,
Regarding correct adjustments for Garcia Mitchell 308 of a replacement NOS Mitchell 81303 Pinion Assembly.......

New 1960's Garcia Mitchell 308 reels, from the Mitchell factory, had a little slop in the in the pinion gear as there are not back to back ball bearing in the bearing race, there is normally as the bearing rotate a small random gap between bearing groups in their respective bearing race.

Question:
So, how do you know if you have the torque pressure adjusted correctly when installing a NOS pinion bearing and same question when you reinstall a maintenanced older 31303 pinion or the reel's original 31303 pinion gear?

Also ...the 308 rotating head does wobble ever so slightly even with a correctly adjusted pinion gear, correct?

i understand, it is a matter of experience, but can you shed light on how to correctly adjust the 81303 pinion gear on a 308 reel?

thank you,
mike

[Sandman]

Hi Mike, great questions. The tiny pinion gear bearings in these reels do wear out and are difficult to keep them greased without complete disassembly.

1) Pinion gear torque: this is completely by feel. I torque down (by hand) the nut above the bearing race (this is the nut underneath the rotating head that holds the bearing races together shown as the knurled nut in the attached photo) while rotating the bearing races until I have the torque I am looing for. Snug, but does not restrict the bearing race rotation to any degree. Then, when I screw the pinion gear into the housing I stop as soon as the washer above the nut hits the head. Then, use the axle nut on the inside of the head to tighten down the pinion. This is where a problem can occur. When tightening down that nut, it can rotate the axle a bit and tighten the knurled down onto the races more. So you have to hold the pinon from below the head while tightening the axle nut to ensure it doesn't do that. In the end, you test the result by spinning the races to ensure you have the torque you are looking for. Sometimes it takes several tries. Races need to spin free, but as little race/bearing gaps as possible.

2) Head wobble: For the most part, there should be no wobble, particularly side to side wobble. Or barely noticeable at most. If more than barely detectible, its likely you could tighten the knurled nut down a little more. If you are referring to head wobble while rotating at high speeds, that is somewhat normal and varies from reel to reel.

Sandman

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[my308]

Sandman,
thank you for the excellent response.
mike

[my308]

Sandman,
thank you for the excellent response.
mike