What does the S stand for

[Crappie54]

My Brother bought a Mitchell CAP 304S and he wants to know what does the S stand for. The CAP 304S was produced from 70-73 and all other reels with the S on them were produced from 1979 to 1987 according to this website. We compared his 304S to one of my CAP reels and other than the S there is no difference between the reels. Thanks for any help.

[jtwill98]

Someone correct me if I am wrong, but I think the "S" after the number is an abbreviation for Skirted. I believe this was mentioned in B. R. Frewing's booklet "Mitchell Birth of a Legend".

[piscesman]

Welcome to the site. According to Dennis Roberts Guides the "S" stands for heavy duty main gear for saltwater application. Hope this helps.....
Kim

[jtwill98]

Maybe the S means different things for different models.

This article (https://www.fishingtalks.com/old-mitche ... 18516.html) agrees with B. R. Frewings booklet. On page 16 of Frewings booklet "S Skirted" is listed in the "Abbreviations Used After Reel Numbers" section, which makes sense for the Mitchell Models 300, 304, 308, 309, 400, 408 and 409 reels.

And, from article sited above at the fishingtalks.com site:
The 300S/301S
Skirted spools make these models easy to distinguish from the other 300s. Made in the mid-to late-’80s.

I'm not trying to be argumentative. I just had to verify my memory, that I remember seeing it mention in Frewings booklet and elsewhere.

However, I have a 304S and it's definitely not skirted and I don't recall seeing a skirted 304 reel. There are pictures of the 300S & 308S online that have skirted spools.

[GreatLaker]

My Brother bought a Mitchell CAP 304S and he wants to know what does the S stand for. The CAP 304S was produced from 70-73 and all other reels with the S on them were produced from 1979 to 1987 according to this website. We compared his 304S to one of my CAP reels and other than the S there is no difference between the reels. Thanks for any help.

Crappie54,
As far as I know there has yet to be found any solid proof of what the letters stand for. How could you know, yet alone prove, what the people at Mitchell SA or whoever were thinking? If someone who was there when it was decided what the "S" meant, they have not come forward as far as I know.
So what do we as collectors do as there are many unanswered Mitchell mysteries? Myself, I keep looking and studying, hoping that some day our questions will be answered.

jtwill98,
I am familiar with your sources and there are several others out there. If you look at our Glossary you will find another. There is no shortage of folks who have answered the question at hand but I think you will find there is no concrete proof. Now as far as Wallace goes, I completely respect his opinion and have read everything he has written that I could get my hands on, but not all yet darn it. Wallace will be the first to tell you we lack concrete proof for many Mitchell mysteries but his knowledge far surpasses most folks out there.

You will have to determine who to believe regarding topics such as this for yourself. Better yet, find the concrete proof for us collectors, we would all love to see it.
Kind Regards,
Bill

[Bailarm]

Who is going to be brave enough to open up a 304S so we can see if the gears are of a different metal to a 304?

If you do make sure you choose exactly the right screwdriver. Mitchell screw heads have shallow slots and those screws are just chrome plated brass and can be the very devil to get out undamaged.

[Altex]

According to the production records, the "S" suffix was used on several models including the 300, 400, 306 and 308 from 1982 -86. These reels all had a skirted spool.

The "S" suffix was used on the 304 from 1970 -73 and this reel was made alongside the regular 304 for just over 2 years. The 304S reel did not have a skirted spool. According to the excellent book by Joy van Hengst the 304S had slightly different gearing (1:1.4 as opposed to 1:1.31) to the 304 and a slightly faster retrieve.

I can't imagine that the 304 would have been used much for sea fishing.

[Bailarm]

Apparently Chris Shannon has already compared both....and could find no difference!

How strange.

[Altex]

I can't help as I don't have examples of these reels.

Clearly, Carpano thought they were different and Joy van Hengst highlighted a small difference.

If I had these reels, I would look at the gears and check diameters and the number of teeth.

[cshannon772]

Hi Mates,
Nobby, Thats not exactly what I posted, but in a response to a question from another Mate several years ago so I included it below.

"Hi Johnny,
Prior to 1959 the 304 had planamatic gearing, then from 1959 through end of production it had crosswind gearing. The only difference between the 304S and the 304 is the engraving on the faceplate, the anti-reverse lever, the handle and the main gear. All of the parts on the 304 and 304S are interchangeable. So it's impossible to know if you have a 304S with a 304 faceplate or a 304 with a 304S Main Gear - either way, these are great reels to collect and to fish with!"

I have several NIB Mitchell 304S reels and I thought I had posted my research and comparison to the 304 but it was a number of years ago and may have been lost with the unfortunate demise of the previous Mitchell Reel Museum. I can easily re-do and post the comparison photos and results of my research if there is interest. The 304S is Mitchells first use of the "S" suffix (followed closely by the 440S) neither of which are skirted spool reels as are the later "S" reels. It has been thought that the "S" was for saltwater use but I can find no evidence of this although the 304S does have a larger handle and slightly larger main gear that is coated or a different material (can't recall exactly) than the 304. I have used my 304 on many saltwater excursions for mackerel and bluefish - makes for exciting fishing!!

Kind Regards,
Chris

[Altex]

Excellent, definitive post.

[jtwill98]

Here are a couple photos of my Mitchell 304 and 304S reels. The photos show a closeup of the main gear and the reel internals.

From the photos, 304S main and pinion gears looks a bit beefier. That may be because the 304S has seen much less usage and less grease on the gears. The 304 has been well used.

I'll include photos of my 314 in the next post.

[jtwill98]

Here are a couple photos of my Mitchell 314 reel.

Notice all three Mitchel reels appear to be roughly the same diameter, have the same number of teeth (48) but each has it's own gearing for line wrap. I believe the 314 is planamatic gearing, but I defer to the experts.

While not pictured, the Mitchell 304S and 314 look like they had the same larger handles, similar in style to the mid 60s Mitchell 300 handles. The Mitchell 304 had the traditional 304 short shaft handle.

[cshannon772]

Hello Mates,
I went back through some of my notes on the Garcia Mitchell 304S and thought I would update.

Mitchell 304S.jpg (180.62 KiB) Viewed 15809 times

These are a few of the Mitchell 304Ss in my collection. All three are MIB with box matching numbers and all of the paperwork; the center is a European distribution Mitchell 304S (No Garcia). The 304S as previously stated, was made from 1970-1973 and a little over 84,000 were made. There were no 305S manufactured which I find as odd because Mitchell was still making the 305 and 315 at the time. Also, I can find no advertising for the 304S in 1969 - 1973 Garcia Fishing Annuals nor the Garcia Fishing Tackle Catalogs. With regard to part numbers, the Handle Assembly for the 304S and 314 are the same; The drive gear is the same for the 304 and 314 but the 304S is #82014 and finally all of the cover plates will have different part numbers: the 304S being #82015. Now for the interesting part:

Mitchell 304S.1.jpg (144.48 KiB) Viewed 15809 times

It would seem to me that if the "S" represented a new model 304 reel for saltwater fishing, the owner's brochure would clearly state it, however, this (all three are the same) brochure clearly refers to "most kinds of freshwater fishing". Only my opinion and I leave the final determination up to the interested individual. I hope this answers some questions.

Kind Regards,
Chris